S30V vs. ZDP-189, CPM-154, ELMAX. However, the high degree of hardness makes this steel difficult to sharpen. I was cutting two layers of double wall corrugated cardboard and slipped off and punched the concrete with Elmax. Thanks in advance for your help. ELMAX Steel There has been a lot of hype recently about ELMAX steel. I don't see myself getting another custom for a long time, so I want to make sure I get the best steel I can. It’s a very hard steel and is exceptionally difficult to sharpen. http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-zero-tolerance-0620cf-emerson-tanto.htm, http://zt.kaiusaltd.com/knives/knife/zt0620cf. I prefer it to S30V, but that is just me. Disadvantages: Relatively difficult to sharpen, can be prone to chipping in certain applications. VG10 and N690Co. For complete re-sharpening, they're about the same. ). Problem solved! You didnt say what kind of custom knife. How would you say CTS-XHP compares to CPM-M4? Only problem is that it's not stainless. Well, CPM154 is also in there but I think the other steels are generally better. Press J to jump to the feed. Advantages: Wear resistance, corrosion resistance. CPM 3V or 3v Steel is a high toughness wear-resistant tool steel, and it was built to offer maximum resistance from breakage, it’s used for stamping tools, blanking tools, knives, slitters, and scrap choppers. M390 and S90V have higher impact toughness at higher hardnesses compared to Elmax (PM PLASTIC MOULD STEELS–WEAR RESISTANT AND CORROSION RESISTANT MARTENSITIC CHROMIUM STEELS; C. Kerschenbauer,M.O. Basically the things I wanna know are: -How does the edge retention compare? In the Comparison on cts 204p vs m390 steel that M390 is first and foremost an awesome edge retention steel. The granule size of the metal powder is very small. CPM 3V Steel Chemical … Tony8179. I have no experience with Elmax or M390. Recommended for long production runs of smaller and complicated shapes and/or reinforced plastics. 4,066. From my EDC experience I personally rank: 1. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. To that effect, I have found that Elmax is easier to touch up on my Sharpmaker. My prelim finding seem to point to S35VN, but I'm not 100% sure. Substituting niobium carbides for some of the vanadium carbides makes CPM S35VN about 15-20% tougher than CPM S30V without … ELMAX VS S90V I wasnt sure what to expect but I did have some decent expectations. Re: Elmax … I'm not sure how ELMAX compares to these two, but it's in my head that it would go like this: No one of those among best steels available now - you should ask for CTS-XHP. Please see this thread here in Tech Support: I'm looking into having a custom knife made for me, and I have these three steels available to pick from. All things pocket knives. By popular request I have created a steel chart, where I try to simply map out the relative merits of each steel. BobSig Jan 27, 2012. Also I am interested in hearing opinions of those that have used M390 and Elmax and how they performed compared to either S30V or S35VN. The shop where I am buying it specs it as ELMAX: http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-zero-tolerance-0620cf-emerson-tanto.htm (look for 'Staalsoort: ELMAX', the website is in dutch) But the ZT website says M390 indeed: http://zt.kaiusaltd.com/knives/knife/zt0620cf. K390 and Elmax are both great steels but intended for different uses. It seems that I will be paying around $40 more for a M390 Barrage vs. a S30V Barrage. The 0620CF has a M390 blade, not Elmax. BladeForums has ZERO TOLERANCE for extremism or calls of violence. It also has some pretty respectable toughness, and can take a good hard beating. The 0620 comes with ELMAX powder steel, and the 0620cf comes with M390. … Imo s30v, s35v, and elmax are pretty much comparable in terms of ease of sharpening. This means that the combination of alloys in the steel make it more susceptible to dulling with repeated use. molybdenum steel vs vg10. I still got a Starmate that I cherrish. I feel that the Elmax will be a great steel but difficult to re-sharpen for most people. An alternative to r/knives. UDDEHOLM ELMAX SUPERCLEAN 6 Type of end mill Carbide Cutting data Solid indexable High speed parameters carbide insert steel Cutting speed (v C) m/min. Experts at sharpening can get it done but they have also said that it takes them a lot longer to sharpen than other High End Steels. ELMAX VS S30V Elmax and S30V are close regarding ease of sharpness, corrosion resistance, and toughness, but for the edge retention, Elmax offers a superior one. S30V – 2000°F (20% carbide volume) ZDP-189 and CTS-XHP already outperform carbon steels. I've heard the CBN or diamond rods fare better, but I don't have either. Thanks for pointing it out, I am emailing the company right now! It is tougher than other popular metals such as 440C and D2, as well as more wear resistant. Toughness? Hopefully M390 and Elmax will become more readily available. Cookies help us deliver our Services. It put an impressive chip in the concrete and just blunted the blade a little, no chips. Edge Retention/Wear Resistance - CPM 3V steel does not hold its edge as well as some other steels like S35VN or S30V. Bumping this to get some feedback.... May 21, … https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-has-a-zero-tolerance-policy-towards-threats-of-violence-extremism-be-warned.1769537/, http://playground.sun.com/~vasya/Manila-Rope-Results.html, http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=793481, (You must log in or sign up to reply here. Both have excellent corrosion resistance. It was a mistake by the knifecompany I purchased it from. The closer to 20 points the “better” the steel. Elmax can be found in many Microtech knives. It looks like it's a little easier to sharpen and holds an edge better. S90V seems obviously superior to S30V but I am not sure specifically in which regard. What will it be used for? This comparison conveys the largest gap in edge retention, as private reviewers were unhappy with how quickly the S30V blade became blunt for general cutting on typical items like rugs. As you’d expect the carbon content is very high but the secret here is the extreme quantities of vanadium, almost three times that found in Elmax or S30V. Comparing Elmax to S30V though, I like Elmax a little better overall. I'm a fan of CPM154. Produced by Bohler-Uddenholm, ELMAX steel is a "high chromium-vanadium-molybdenum-alloyed steel," made of 1.7 percent carbon, 18 percent chromium, .3 percent manganese, 1 percent molybdenum, .8 percent silicon, and 3 percent vanadium. Jan 27, 2012 #1. CPM-154 . You won’t see much wear at all from the thing even through some pretty rough use. Less wear because of good wear resistance -What is the corrosion resistance like in comparison to S30V? Its chemistry promotes the formation and even distribution of vanadium carbides, which are harder and more effective at cutting than chromium carbides. Crucible’s CPM S90V steel approaches the very pinnacle of wear resistance and edge retention. Elmax is an amazingly well-rounded steel when you take all of these factors into consideration. Many of those who use it will say that it is far superior to S35VN steel. The claims stating it to be a superior “super-steel,” are more than true, as ELMAX steel continues to impress all who use it. S60V like S90V felt “elastic” under the stone. S90V. I have been warned that it will not be easy to Grind and Finish but I really have no way of knowing that until I use it. That being said, according to Crucible's testing it holds an edge better than D2 (which is a comparable tool steel used in knifemaking) at a hardness 60 RC. Comparing Elmax to S30V though, I like Elmax a little better overall. 111 1 0. In my experience, with regular maintenance, both will stay sharp pretty much indefinitely. So if you use triangle to sharp the zt0566 - you'd have hard time doing it. Elmax does have more chromium, so it may be a bit more corrosion resistant. Hey guys, I've got a few questions for you all, concerning the steel types ELMAX and S30V. See more S30V steel knives. CPM 3V VS Steel . I decided to do this on 20 point scale, where I assign a maximum of 5 points to the 4 categories of Ease of Sharpening, Toughness, Edge Retention and Corrosion Resistance. It both holds an edge well and is tough, unlike a lot of other exotic steels that make you choose (ZDP-189, for instance). Feb 20, 2008. This result is somewhat surprising because based on … No comparison. ("Regular maintenance" for me is touching up on the Sharpmaker before the edge actually gets noticeably dull, which I have found to be much easier overall than letting it really get dull and having to completely re-sharpen.). I have knives with every mentioned steel, even 0566 - I sharpened it a day ago an its primary problem was factory angle. So that is probably where they mixed up. S30V was less tricky than S60V and perhaps tougher. It may seem like there’s a big step down between a steel like S110V and CPM 154. But the difference is so minimal that I would never let it dictate a preference between different knives. From my measurements it was higher than 40 degrees, so absolutely un-triangble. Please help me out on this one, I'd really appreciate that! Its chemistry has been rebalanced so that it forms some niobium carbides along with vanadium and chromium carbides. Hey, at 20% chromium, it’s also really good at corrosion resistance! Elmax is a third generation powder metalurgy stainless steel. It is also easier to machine and polish than CPM S30V. I have not had any of my S30V or Elmax blades stain or rust. CPM S35VN is a martensitic stainless steel designed to offer improved toughness over CPM S30V. What it is: CPM S30V is a "Crucible Particle Metallurgy" stainless steel, widely regarded as a "super steel" for its properties and performance. But a real powerhouse super steel is ELMAX. In operation since 1998, BladeForums.com has led the industry since Day 1. Hey... that is very weird. CPM S30V. To address your "Elmax vs S30v" question, both alloys fill the "high end general purpose stainless niche" and I've been quite happy with both of them in Spyderco blades. That test involves repeatedly cutting a tough, abrasive, fibrous material repeatedly until the edge dulls. I'd also like to check out something from these people: Diamondblade. He get close to Crucible for getting the powder steel he wanted. This does not bode well as edge retention is a top, if not the top, priority for knife fanatics. I like CPM-M4. S30V steel is a popular stainless steel, which, like ELMAX, is a powder-made steel. S30V ELMAX CPM154 I know it's all down to the maker/heat treatment, but in general terms, which is looked at higher? Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. We request your assistance dealing with this as we do not want to see the site shut down due to violent threats. Are you adept at sharpening knives? That test involves repeatedly cutting a tough, abrasive, fibrous material repeatedly until the edge dulls. Joe. The thread seems to point towards M390 being a superior steel as well easier to sharpen compared to the S90V. ELMAX is tougher but S30V has better edge retention. Discussion in 'General Knife Discussion' started by jfindon, Jan 18, 2011. -How easy is it to sharpen? Today I've ordered a ZT0620CF knife, which comes with carbon handlescales and ELMAX steel. S30V is right in the sweet spot for me--very good at everything. A high chromium content stainless (14 percent) that contains molybdenum and vanadium, which enhances the toughness, corrosion resistance, and edge holding ability. Holland Member Posts: 7203 Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 4:37 am Location: Alberta. S30V was an impulsion coming from Chris Reeve. I saw that the sprint run of the Squeak will have Elmax steel. I recently bought a ZT0301 with a S30V blade, great knife, love the feel and the build. Do you live in a humid/coastal climate? Thanks for the reply :) Does the toughness of the ELMAX outweigh the retention of the S30V? By Larry Connelley When looking at quality American-made knives, you'll notice that S35VN and S30V steel are two of the more popular steels for knife blades. Those things make a difference when choosing steel. If fixed, what size? You can use this chart to try to find the best steel for you. Thanks!! Jan 18, 2011 #2. However, in toughness testing that we performed Niolox was not particularly spectacular, similar to the PM steel 40CP, but significantly lower than CPM-154, and much worse than AEB-L. My impression is that when VG10 was first introduced to the kitchen knife market it was one of the better non-powder steels available. 11,879 2,999 113. This is my first user with this steel (usually Sandvik or D2). Both S30V and S35VN steel are made with the same carbon and chrome content, and from various tests, both steels provide the same edge retention and corrosion resistance. All things equal, I'd go Elmax. Most everything else comes down to the blade geometry as far as cutting performance overall goes. S30V and tied for 3. K390 maximizes abrasion resistance at the expense of corrosion resistance. Another good steel on paper is the Elmax steel from Europe being used in a couple of blades (mainly Kershaw stuff). The 2000°F heat treatment microstructure appears to have smaller carbides than S30V and Elmax so we expect better toughness than those steels. As far as newer steels, I'd love to use some of the D2 that ESEE is using. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. CPM 3V VS ELMAX; CPM 3V VS S30V (CPM S30V) Conclusion; Reach your true potential; Reach your true potential; what is CPM 3V steel. ZDP189 2. -Anything else noteworthy :). OnceBitten Momma said I'd go blind Brigade Member. Welcome back Vassili. For me that steel used to have a very strong aura of being able to cut and cut and cut…. Speidel), and they are all in the range of CPM154 and S30V for impact values. BobSig Huge member. Both are stainless so you don't have to worry about corrosion. level 2. Trying to re-sharpen (vs. touch-up) on the ceramic rods on a Sharpmaker is either an exercise in patience or futility. Vanax has smaller carbides/nitrides than these other steels, however, because it is largely free of chromium carbides and because nitrides coarsen very slowly. Elmax is a more balanced steel. Elmax is superior on paper to S30V in pretty much every way. For me, I've found that Elmax is easier to touch up between sharpenings with a strop. Top. Yet when compared to ELMAX, it does not perform as well. There are many stainless steels with high wear resistance like S30V, Elmax, and M390, and a few with high toughness like AEB-L but not much between. Sep 28, 2011 #2. As I have no prior expirience with ELMAX steel, how does it compare to S30V? I have got a ZT0350 which has got the S30V steel, so I know how the edge holds and all. S30V vs. S35VN Steel: Differences and Advantages of Each. I can never seem to get S35VN (nearly the same thing as S30V) back to as hair whittling compared to when it's fresh off the stones. I dropped my knife in S35VN onto concrete, the tip broke off, and got two chips in the blade. Maxamet Vs. S30V. CPM S30V is a martensitic (hardened) powder-made (sintered) wear and corrosion resistant stainless steel developed by Dick Barber of Crucible Industries in collaboration with knifemaker Chris Reeve. S30V Knife Steel. Realistically, in normal day to day use you would struggle to pick out any differences in comparison. Folder or fixed blade? S30V & S35VN are the real powerhouses. This is a powder-metal steel also produced by Crucible. Uddeholm Elmax SuperClean is a powder metallurgically produced mold steel characterized by a combination of very good wear resistance, corrosion resistance and dimensional stability. Elmax and S35VN are both very close steel that offers premium and balanced quality. When ground to 62 HRC, an ELMAX blade is far more dependable than one made of S30V. Some controlled tests I have seen from others puts wear resistance of Elmax a bit above S30V. S60V (CPM T440V) / S90V (CPM T420V) High vanadium content allows these two steel grades to be outstanding at … Does anyone have anything that compares these steel in toughness against S30V or even better yet S35VN? Some controlled testsI have seen from others puts wear resistance of Elmax a bit above S30V. I use DMT diamond stones though, and those aggressively cut through every steel I've tried (including ZDP-189 and S110V). The following summary explains some of the most commonly used steel grades grouped as non-stainless and stainless steels. Based on these rankings, where would you place Elmax and M390 ? The performance of Elmax is far superior to S30V.